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https://omeka.library.appstate.edu/files/original/2200d1209d06673630bab91b8fee4e81.mp3
b451c065bd4196a79fecbb1149588e10
https://omeka.library.appstate.edu/files/original/7b7ee1eed3e098039fbec481d0138bb7.pdf
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Military Oral History Interview Transcript
Jeffrey A. Gordon, U.S. Army Veteran Sergeant First Class, retired
Skype Interview - Boone, NC
16 October 2011
MG: Matthew Gordon
JC: SPC Jeffrey A. Gordon, retired
MG: It is Sunday, October 16th, 2011. I am at home in Boone, North Carolina conducting an
interview via Skype with retired U.S. Army Veteran Sergeant First Class Jeffrey A. Gordon. I
am Cadet Matthew Gordon of Appalachian State University, and I will begin the oral history
now. Sergeant Gordon, where were you born and raised?
JC: I was born and raised in Logansport, Indiana.
MG: When was your birthday?
JC: September 18, 1960.
MG: What did you do just before you joined the armed forces? Where were you living at the
time?
JC: We were living in Logansport, Indiana and worked several different jobs.
MG: When and why did you choose to join the military?
JC: Because I wanted to get out of Logansport, Indiana.
MG: Okay, at what age did you enlist?
JC: I enlisted when I was 17 as a junior in high school, and was leaving for active duty after I
graduated in 1979.
MG: Was there a family history of military service that inspired you or were you one of the first
in your family to join the military?
JC: My Grandpa was in the army at one time, during World War Two, but other than that I was
the first one from the direct family to join.
MG: Did your parents approve of you wanting to serve?
JC: My dad. My grandpa was in the Marine Corps as well.
MG: Okay, okay.
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�MG: Did your parents approve of you wanting to serve in the military?
JC: Yes, because like I said he was in the Marine Corps and then actually my uncle was in the
Marine Corps as well that probably helped inspire me.
MG: Sure.
MG: Why did you choose the enlistment route over the officer route?
JC: Because I was ready to get out of Logansport and I figured I'd get my college in the Army,
which I did.
MG: What was your MOS (military occupational specialty) at the time?
JC: My first MOS was 13 Bravo as a cannon crewman and then after four years of that I
reenlisted as a 97 Echo which was an interrogator (Human Intelligence Collector).
MG: Okay, do you recall your first days in service? What did it feel like?
JC: My first day was traveling to Fort Sill, Oklahoma. It was scary and when I got there it was
very cold and again scary because it was just crazy back the joining for basic training and
everything.
MG: How did you feel about leaving home?
JC: It was different. I was ready to go, ready to leave Logansport. But I had to leave your now
your mother; she was my girlfriend or fiancé…so that wasn't fun. But I was ready to go.
MG: Describe your training? Where was it and how long was it?
JC: We went to Fort Sill, Oklahoma was there for 12 weeks which included the first and then
they started a new program called OSUT, which was One Station Unit Training. We stayed right
there at Fort Sill and went right to the artillery phase of training after basic. It was a total of 12
weeks.
MG: Sure, what are some of the things from your training that stand out in your memory?
JC: The first thing was that I didn't realize I was going be actually a cannon crewman. I thought
I was going be telling the artillery guns where to shoot and working on the computers, but that
didn't work out. There was a little problem with my contract. But it was…it was fun, I mean it
was a lot of hard work, lost weight, got muscle…and worked real hard. I mean I didn't really
workout a whole lot before that. So it was, it was good training.
MG: So, where all did you serve?
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�JC: Well we started at Fort Sill then from there we, I went back to Logansport, Indiana as a
hometown recruiter. I did that for three months, from there went to Fort Carson, Colorado. After
Fort Carson, Colorado went to Babenhausen, Germany. I reenlisted in Babenhausen for
interrogation school went to Fort Huachuca, Arizona and then to Monterey, California for
defense training for Polish.
After that went to Munich, Germany for three years and worked with the 1811 MI Battalion,
debriefing Polish defectors, after that we came back to the United States to Fort Hood, Texas,
and applied to work in the embassy after the wall came down. We applied to come work in the
embassy in Warsaw. I got accepted for that, and then we came to Columbia, Missouri and
worked with the ROTC Department and then I retired.
MG: Okay, how hard was it being away from family, friends, and loved ones?
JC: Well, our family was with us, so leaving Logansport, Indiana wasn't too hard (laughing)
honestly. We were ready to go and travel and see the world.
MG: Sure.
JC: Even though our children thought that it was bad thing to do for...for 17 years, but we did it
anyway
MG: Sure (laughing). What kind of assignments were you assigned to throughout your career?
JC: Well, like I said, four years in the artillery, as a cannon crewman, started out on eight inch
artillery at Fort Carson and then when I went into Babenhausen was also on 8 inch Artillery and
then we did a three month tour with the 105 cannons, which was air assault. After that
interrogation school debriefing Polish defectors for three years in Munich and then went to Fort
Hood.
I was the operations sergeant and actually the platoon sergeant for a counter intelligence platoon
to Warsaw, Poland. I was the Operations NCOIC (non-commissioned officer in charge) for the
defense attaché office and before that we were in Washington, D.C. for training. When we came
back to the United States and was the NCOIC of the Cadet ROTC Detachment. I was the
personnel or NCOIC, then I retired.
MG: Tell me about your most memorable experiments...experiences and highlights throughout
your service?
JC: Oh, that's a tough one. Probably the most fun with the unit, it was a pretty tight group.
Training in Fort Huachuca for interrogation was real interesting and fun. I mean it was tough, but
fun. And then spending three years working with Polish Defectors in Germany was good. It was
a great experience being able to send people to the United States. After that the platoon sergeant
time was because we got accepted to go to Warsaw. Then work in the embassy…that was real
rewarding because again, we were sending Polish military cadets and student to the United
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�States. We enjoyed that and Poland was probably the most fun and rewarding because we did so
many different things.
MG: Sure, so on your time on leave where all did you prefer to travel too or where did you
travel?
JC: Most of the time on leave we always came back home to Logansport because everybody
wanted to see us. But we did get to travel overseas a lot. When we were in Germany we traveled
all over Europe. When we were in Warsaw we got to see the border of Russia unofficially. But
just being able to travel with the military is one of the best things. You do get to see a lot of stuff.
On leave, we always came back home, it seemed like. Instead of taking vacations, which we
probably should have done more.
MG: Did you plan to retire from the Army or was that just something that came too thought as
time passed?
JC: No, I think after the first time I reenlisted I figured we'd stay the whole duration and then
retire because of the benefits and the way everything was going the economy. You know the
benefits are a great thing. Having the medical and having the check come every month, that's
nice.
MG: What did you do towards the end of your career?
JC: Well, towards the end it was more administrative work with ROTC and trying not to lie to
them. Tell them how great the military was at that time (laughing) back in '95. But yes, I mean
ROTC was time go, it was time to retire once I got to that assignment because the military was
drawing down so much. It was time to go, time to move onto something different.
MG: Do you recall the day your service ended? Where were you?
JC: We were in Columbia, Missouri trying to figure out what we were going to do next. We had
two kids and that scared us. We actually all went to Disney World for a week and then came
back and started our own business and worked with training people. So it was different.
MG: How long were you in the service?
JC: About 17 and a-half years. At that time they were allowing people to retire early. So I did
get to retire instead of getting bought out, like they were doing to a lot people. But I did retire
with benefits and medical.
MG: What influential experiences did you draw from the military in general? How has it
affected your life today?
JC: Well, that's a tough one. I think overall, it affects every part of your life. As my wife says,
I'm bossier now (laughing) and in charge, want to be in charge all the time. But, it's just the
overall experience you can’t beat it. I think every 18-year-old kid should go in the military just to
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�get that, whether its two years experience or what. They ought to some type of service because it
just makes you a better person. And you get to see a lot in the world if you go out there. But if
you stay in your hometown all the time, you don't get to.
MG: True. So would you do it all over again if you had the chance?
JC: Oh definitely, we’d go back to Poland now if there was a chance (laughing). Even as a
retired person.
MG: Why would you want to do it all over again?
JC: Oh, I you just, the travel and the people…you get to learn everything and your spending
time in foreign countries and you get to see a lot, a lot when you are in the military if you choose
to go out into the world and go to different places overseas you can't beat it. I just think, don’t
think you can beat it with anything else.
MG: Just to kind of bounce back to another question…what was the transition between field
artillery to interrogation?
JC: Oh, that was huge. That was a totally different concept of combat arms…it was an eye
opener. Combat arms versus a military intelligence unit are different styles of leadership,
different attitudes towards the military. Honestly, dealing with the artillery it was all male, and
then in military intelligence you had to deal with the female aspects of everything as a leader.
And all the different issues that come up. So that was a huge transition and then after, then three
years of that in military intelligence was being in civilian clothes and not really being associated
with the military. So that was fun, but it was also a big transition.
MG: What persuaded you…or what skills or mindset did you have towards switching from field
artillery to interrogation?
JC: I looked at the senior NCOs in artillery and most of them were deaf, or had hearing aids. I
figured after 20 years of shooting artillery I'd be deaf you know in both ears. I already lost
hearing in one ear in four years. So I figured it was time to get out of that. Because you just don't
get to wear your hearing protection when you are trying to hear commands and that type of thing.
Back then, now it's all computerized, so it 's a lot different.
MG: So tell me a little more about this transition, what was training like as far as interrogation
goes?
JC: Well, eight weeks at Fort Huachuca (Arizona) of role playing and actually interrogating you
know learning how to question techniques and dealing with belligerent people. Because
prisoners aren’t always going to tell you what they want. So you got to figure ways to get it out
of them. But stick to the Geneva Convention and not do anything wrong. Eight weeks of that,
and then basically it was one year of learning Polish language, which was a very, very hard year.
A lot of personality problems with the Polish instructors and our son was born the night before
the biggest phase test…and I needed to pass it. So he picked a good time to come into the world
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�(laughing). But it was all worth it. And then I spent another eight weeks learning strategic
debriefing and different techniques like report writing and that type of thing. It was a lot of fun.
MG: Did you see any kind of combat situations? What kind of training were you involved in?
JC: No combat. I guess we are considered Cold War Veterans. When Saddam went into Kuwait,
we were on our way to Washington, D.C. for training. We continued on to Washington and did
not go back to Fort Hood. When the wall came down a lot of the Eastern European languages,
jobs were done away with because they didn't need them anymore. So, no...never saw any
combat. We had our own situations in Poland. But we did get to shoot a lot of weapons in
training.
MG: How hard was it learning the languages? What kind of languages did you have to learn for
interrogation purposes?
JC: Polish. It was a pain in the butt. Four years of college level classes were crammed into one
year, eight hours a day of classroom instruction. Probably two hours of memorizing, two to four
hours a night memorizing statements and phrases and vocabulary and then you go back in the
next day. It was just a constant. It was one year with I think a two week break every three months
or something. It wasn't fun. So a lot of stress, a lot of drinking, a lot of partying on Friday
nights, Saturday nights you party. Sunday night you start studying for class on Monday. Several
weddings, lots of kids born (laughing). It was different.
MG: On that note, what are some of the craziest things you and your buddies did while you were
in the service?
JC: Oh, I don't know what's really crazy outside. I mean we did a lot of crazy fun stuff in the
military. I mean I think one of the funniest things we did or was we had a big pizza party for the
Marine Corps security detachment in Warsaw. I knew the flight crew that was bringing in an
empty plane and we brought in twenty large pizzas from Pizza Hut out of Frankfurt, Germany
(laughing) strapped down in the middle of this 141. We had a pizza party at the Marine Corps
bar that night. Thanks to the Air Force! (laughing) That was probably one of the funniest.
MG: Well (more laughing) is there anything you would like to add that we have not covered in
this interview, or like a closing thought?
JC: A closing thought would be that…to reiterate I think every 18 or 19 year old kid should
go...male or female…should do some type of service in the military or federal government or
something. And get out and see the world…and then maybe come back and go to college. Then
if they decide to join the military, they can go enlisted or officer route. It’s really up to them. It
was a fun time, we did get to see a lot, our kids got to be in foreign countries and travel on
airplanes a lot. No regrets at all in the military. I mean…things change, it's a lot different now
than when I retired in'95, but it's all good.
MG: What kind of changes would you say that have occurred or that you've seen occur since
your time in service?
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�JC: Technology's probably the biggest thing. Another crazy thing we probably did was in 1989
but we had White House communications technology and we set up a little satellite dish on the
runway in Warsaw and I got to call my dad back in Indiana. Back then we had to use a satellite
dish. Now today you can just pick up a phone. So technology is just advanced so much that you
never really kept up with everything in the artillery. There's probably so many computers that
control everything...I mean we did everything by verbal commands. And the uniforms are
different; they are so much better than what it was. That's been 20 something years ago.
MG: Well, I thank you very much for your time and patience throughout the interview. And just
wanted to thank you again.
JC: No problem, thank you
JC: Don't work too hard now!
MG: All right, we'll see you later now.
JC: All right.
MG: Bye.
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�
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Appalachian State University American Military History Course Veterans Oral History Project
Description
An account of the resource
Each semester, the students of the American Military History Course at Appalachian State University conduct interviews with military veterans and record their military experiences in order to create an archive of oral history interviews that are publicly accessible to researchers. The oral histories are permanently available in the Appalachian State University Special Collections. The project is supervised by Dr. Judkin Browning, Associate Professor of History at Appalachian State University and all interviews are transcribed by the student interviewers.
Copyright Notice:
Copyright for the Veterans Oral History Project’s audio and transcripts is held by Appalachian State University. These materials are available for free personal, non-commercial, and educational use, provided that proper citation is used (e.g. Veterans Oral History Project, University Archives and Records, Special Collections, Appalachian State University, Boone, NC).
Oral History
A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge.
Interviewee
The person(s) being interviewed.
Gordon, Jeff
Interviewer
The person(s) performing the interview.
Gordon, Matthew
Interview Date
10/16/11
Duration
Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.)
22:46 min
Copyright
Copyright for the Veterans Oral History Project's audio and transcripts is held by Appalachian State University. These materials are available for free personal, non-commercial, and educational use, provided that proper citation is used.
Tag
Army, NCO, Logansport, Indiana, cannon crewman, human intelligence collector, interrogator, Fort Sill, Fort Carson, Germany, Fort Hood, ROTC, Fort Huachuca, University of Missouri, Poland, enlisted man
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Interview with Jeff Gordon, 16 October 2011
Subject
The topic of the resource
Cold War
Gordon, Jeff, 1960-
United States
Veterans
Military Intelligence
Interviews
Army
Officers
Description
An account of the resource
Jeff Gordon, born September 18, 1960, served 17 and a half years in the U.S. Army (enlisting in 1979), retiring as a Veteran Sergeant First Class. He served as a cannon crewman and interrogator (Human Intelligence Collector). In the interview he talks about his career (including service in seven states, Germany, and Poland) plus the benefits for U.S. youth to see the world through military service.
Creator
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Gordon, Jeff
Gordon, Matthew
Source
A related resource from which the described resource is derived
<a title="UA.5018. American Military History Course Records" href="https://appstate-speccoll.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/167" target="_blank">UA.5018. American Military History Course Records</a>
Extent
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7 pages
Language
A language of the resource
English
cannon crewman
Fort Sill Oklahoma
Germany
interrogation
Logansport
Marine Corps
ROTC